MotoGP Indy

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MotoGP Indy

Post by TopContender on Sat Aug 20 2011, 16:33

Anyone know about this series? They are running Harleys at Indy. I guess they removed the kid race after last year's tragedy.


AMA PRO VANCE & HINES XR1200 SERIES

The AMA Pro Vance & Hines XR1200 Series is a spec-bike race series featuring specially modified Harley-Davidson XR1200 motorcycles. Vance & Hines is the title sponsor and official kit supplier for the class. The special kits consist of a Vance & Hines XR1200 exhaust system, a Fuelpak fuel management system, race bodywork including number plate, single-seat tail section and belly pan, 17- inch front wheel with matching front fender, steering damper, oil cooler relocator and race decal package. The cost for the complete kit, which does not include the price of the motorcycle, is $3,500.00.

As in all AMA Pro Road Racing divisions, Dunlop will provide the spec tire for the class and Sunoco will fuel the racers with their Sunoco 260 GTX fuel.

In addition to the Vance & Hines supplied kit parts, teams will be able to upgrade their suspension, hand and foot controls, brake components and instrumentation.

This exciting new series will provide loyal Harley-Davidson owners, dealers and enthusiasts a chance to join the action at selected AMA Pro Road Racing weekends throughout the country.
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Re: MotoGP Indy

Post by Henrik on Sun Aug 21 2011, 01:16

Can't say I know anything about the AMA series for the XR1200. I saw one in the UK racing with those bikes though.

Other than a publicity stunt from Harley I can't really see the interest. Seriously, the chassis is crap and the engine dates from the stone age. I am sure if you take any competent street fighter like a KTM Super Duke, Triumph Speed Triple, Aprilia Tuono, Ducati Streetfighter (or my Moto Morini Corsaro) in stock form it would run circles around the XR1200. It's a bit like if they strated racing John Deere tractors as a support race for the Indy 500...

Other than that, not sure what to say...

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Re: MotoGP Indy

Post by H8R on Sun Aug 28 2011, 16:29

The bikes suck.

The guys riding them are some of the same guys who race regular bikes in AMA, and amazingly fast and talented.

It's is often the most exciting race of the weekend for novice fans...with lots of crashes on those POS. The bikes themselves are kit bikes, almost like the old IROC series.

It's mockingly referred to as the "Nationwide race" by fans of roadracing because of the NASCAR type of crashes and American, Detroit built crap.

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Re: MotoGP Indy

Post by Henrik on Sun Aug 28 2011, 21:11

Just watched the Indy race. Casey is a freak.

On another note, and I have said this previou years, that track just sucks for bike racing. All the stop and go corners just ruins it, and I lost count on the number of messed up trajectories the riders had. Compare that to a track like Assen or Philip Island and it just seems even worst.

Bummer Spies messed up his start, because he did have a good pace after that, and he might have been able to fight for a higher place on the podium.

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Re: MotoGP Indy

Post by TopContender on Sun Aug 28 2011, 22:45

I think the race is ran in the wrong direction. It is the opposite of the F1 track. As for Ducati, they better get their shit together because the are in the back of the grid for everything. I knew it was bad when I saw all the Ducati riders warm up the bikes by locking the front up and doing indows. Every Ducati rider was leaning over their bikes on the cool down trying to figure out what was happening. It was a mess.
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Re: MotoGP Indy

Post by Henrik on Mon Aug 29 2011, 08:11

The main problem with the Ducati is the front. They are not getting the grip they need, and so there is no confidence at all in the front of the bike. On a track like Indy, this makes things even worst as there are some hard braking areas, where you ae on the brake also well in to the corner.

Hayden tried running a soft front, which helped him in the beginning (as you mentioned the Ducati riders locking up the front on the warm-up lap trying to get some heat in to the tires) but then there was simply no grip left in the front. It was sad to see him struggle to the point of having to pull in at the end. At least he got back out there to finish the race...

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Re: MotoGP Indy

Post by H8R on Thu Sep 01 2011, 02:54

If you guys haven't read this article about the C/F Ducati...I suggest you do.

http://www.motomatters.com/analysis/2011/08/08/the_trouble_with_the_ducati_desmosedici_.html
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Re: MotoGP Indy

Post by TopContender on Wed Sep 07 2011, 00:17

Well that was a nice read. The Ducati sounds like a Dinosaur that needs major updates. It explains what I was seeing at the race with the riders all looking at the front tyres.

On another note, Indy has signed up for MotoGP until 2014
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Re: MotoGP Indy

Post by Revs on Wed Sep 07 2011, 07:47

great articles H8, cheers Smile
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Re: MotoGP Indy

Post by Henrik on Wed Sep 07 2011, 17:30

It is a good article, and sums up pretty much what I have been reading on a number of other places. At the end of the day, the Ducati is simply not working!

When Stoner won on the bike back in 2007, they were using the old trellis fram chassis which was likely behind the ones used by Yamaha and Honda. However they had an engine advantage, and somebody willing to ride the thing beyond the edge all of the time. Since then, the others have caught up in engine power, but Ducati have just not been able to make up their deficit in chassis design.

Sometimes I wonder if they would better results if they took Checa's WSBK and ran it in MotoGP instead of the GP11.

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Re: MotoGP Indy

Post by TopContender on Thu Sep 08 2011, 01:34

Is the L4 engine that important? Also could abandoning the desmo valve for pneumatics be the way to go? To me Ducati is bigger than engine angle or 50 year old valve tech.
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Re: MotoGP Indy

Post by Revs on Thu Sep 08 2011, 08:21

TopContender wrote:To me Ducati is bigger than engine angle or 50 year old valve tech.

definitely
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Re: MotoGP Indy

Post by Henrik on Thu Sep 08 2011, 10:00

The desmo valves are not holding them back. I think it is fair to say there is no problem in the power delivery, and even though desmo valves may be 50 year old technology, don't forget the combustion engine in itself is 150 year old technology! No, it does seem more like the problem comes from the 90° angle, which is obiously a Ducati signature, making the engine too long somehow.

When you look at the bikes, it seems to me the Yamaha and especially the Honda look more compact.

As to Ducati being bigger than engine angle and 50 year old technology, it is a tough call. They are a tiny company in comparison to Honda, Yamaha and Suzuki, and also smaller than Harley Daidson to which they can be more easily compared to. They sell their bikes based so much on their image. For any normal street rider, I am pretty sure they would be able to go faster around a track with a Honda CBR1000R or a Yamaha R1 than a Ducati 1198, but riders lust after the 1198 because of its image and the sound and feeling then engine brings. I think it is important to maintain this image also with their top racing bike.

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